And the person made the lecture about as long to read as David Platt like talking head sermon. Another reason the SBC is a joke. (2) The born-again experience: i.e. @ Gram3: At least theyre coming to understand that, whilst its relatively simple to join something, belonging is more complex. The scripture says that we are saved unto good works, For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath ordained that we should walk in them.. Ephesians 2:10 KJV, So, why would it not be both. These Neo-Cal guys act like they have answers for everything; they are the new wave, the latest and greatest. Warning: Calvins ICR is not the true gospel of Jesus Christ, but a clever vicious lie smothering the life out of the Christian believer who seeks to embrace this incessant smoldering darkness. But I have to ask, how can the walking podcast be my shepherd? Id settle for an acceptable church. I think I now have the answer. I dont have a problem with the word pastor being used for clergy. © 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022 - The Wartburg Watch. That kind of New Testament model? It is not a place where 1 man is in charge. But I experienced him as my (now former) pastor and while he may be a great speaker, he is not a good pastor. To be fair to Platt, in his final sermon I referenced he actually made a strong plea for Christians to go to different countries not as professional missionaries, but as workers with regular jobs who can spread the Gospel through normal contacts and also assist to strengthen local churches. Is it a worship service or a rock concert? Sometimes I think it insults womens intelligence that man cant be a corporate term. I learned recently that these titles are very important in that world. Maybe not. Experts warn David and Victoria Beckhams little girl may end up with speech or dental issues if she continues to use on, wrote Jemma Buckley in an article for The Daily Mail. Stetzerwrote an article for Christianity Today about Platt's new position. Having been in SBC churches for 20 years, I can honestly say that most megachurch sermons are shallow and quite devoid of teaching of Scripture. @ Bill: The produce being sold includes commercial growers, according to the signs on their pickup trucks. I also have an active prayer closet and know how to use it. The man boy who took over my former church immediately had his title changed to lead pastor. Not to mention the let-us-introduce-you-to-some-seminary-students during nursing school. So if it is the means then why are people upset when Platt says that people need to get with it regarding the means? I mean, they were so mad I have no doubt theyre trying to find me. Those things cannot be torn apart and pitted against each other; they are part and parcel of the whole. So why do we continue supporting this made up role? Arrrgh. Sometimes I think it insults womens intelligence that man cant be a corporate term. It is like they think they are crossing some sort of line if they drop their guard and form genuine relationships. Folks, find a church in which you have a real pastor, not a talking head who offers nothingdifferent than apodcast Find a pastor who knows your names and will come and sit with you when you are in the hospital. MBC deserves a full time pastor. We should do so, so the table is still valid, but so is the pulpit if governments/culture allows. Bless him). You can feel it! Its reductionistic, but I like the Church gathered to worship (edify, exhort, encourage) and be fed; then the Church scattered (respective families, jobs, neighborhoods) to do missions/evangelism. It evolved; a culture developed around it; rules and regulations; holidays and celebrations; the yearly church calendar; working people could show up, pay up, and leave; eventually the CEO posted a job roster for the volunteers; duties and titles; gender roles; power and access became linked to donated money; book$ and conference$ and web$ite$ and broadcast$; celebrity and status; trips and missions and safaris; etc. God. The messages were pretty much the same. I did join it after attending for a year and then left after four months. Is there anyone who has a word from the LORD? What their job is, without exception, is pastoring a church for expats. Its possible this man simply feigned interest in my mother hoping she would tell him that she would leave some $$$ to the church. He was the celebrity Pastor who would get the young men excited. Platt is a proven winner especially among a certain psychographic and he is a young man who can be in the pulpit for many years at MBC. In many of them, and also non-denoms, they are both shallow AND long. ishy wrote: In kind renumeration is not a salary as you mention. Ok, maybe Im missing something but hes offering to preach for free, the church is being very wise in theyre decision making, David Platt knows his family and what he needs to do to spend time with him. Platt, unfortunately, was merely a podcast in person. : > God so loved YOU that He sent His only Son, Jesus, that if YOU will believe in Him, YOU will not perish, but receive Gods eternal life. I think the answer lies in two seemingly unrelated things sometime ~1997 when 9Marks took off and when SGM became Reformed. C.J. He was senior pastor at the Church at Brook Hills in Birmingham, Alabama, from 2006 to 2014. They said its a new testament model so it is. It is ended, neither by might of appeal (marketing) nor power of delivery systems, but by My Spirit, says the LORD. Wonder what draws the short stick? Its all part of the business. (But seriously, 20-25 hrs a week on prep? Throws a different light on things. Late coming to this, but I have some issues with property taxes in general and can see why that might be a needed exemption. Have you considered that its because most megachurch pastors care very little about Scripture, as thats just not the point? What does this mean? Standing up on a stage, being the only voice heard in a comfortably organised setting where everyone is explicitly there to hear you speak, is among the most seductively intoxicating pleasures anywhere in this life. He could have one or not, but telling everyone when you first meet that he does NOT tells you something and its not a positive thing. Sorry for initiating a rabbit trail but to clarify a classical liberal is more like a libertarian but sees the need for just a tad more government. Thus, the model in the New Testament is shared leadership. MBC used to meet at Langley High School before building a huge church building. I think a marriage of convenience took place, and human nature made sure that it stayed that way when things became very inconvenient a few short years later. Blogs. That is a huge plus for the elders there, I imagine. The impact on the muslim world is accomplished very slowly through sincere friendships made through contacts by normal working people. their church planting efforts out of McLean. The gifts of the Holy Spirit are exercised in a corporate setting. David Platt (ThM, PhD, New Orleans Baptist Theological Seminary) is the pastor-teacher of McLean Bible Church, founder of Radical, and a Council member of The Gospel Coalition. And when it goes badly we want to blame the clergy for not being Jesus to us. Oh thats right, he doesnt do weddings. Because healthy community is missional. The Church gathered to worship is a witness that God indwells His people. Who wants a job where you give everything, then the mob can take a vote as to whether you keep your job or not! Nothing compares to knowing Him! As a former member of Brook Hills where David was once my pastor, I am concerned about this. Hmmmis there NO one in the UK and/or Ireland who can speak at the FIEC Leaders Conference that an American has to be imported? When I entered the state of the art auditorium, I found myself absorbed in a sea of multiple thousands of attendees at one of the multiple Sunday services. I know of churches that have moved into an area and purchased an existing building. My wife just got home from her evening shift & I put in overtime. Therefore, Who God is and what He has done is paramount for the faith community. But maybe thats just me trying to figure out how in the world the Odd Couple ever got together and why Dever sold out what he claims to believe so fervently. When I was in my former church, my husband, a friend and I led a Sunday school class that was well attended. I just see things through a very different lens. But I know I cant do that forever. If you love the Lord and truly follow the Lord, He will open opportunities where He wants you to be. . Ive even seen multi-media pastor. We worked out a formula to give the Sunday school class church a small donation to pay for our seat and the heating, etc. So, again, how is this guy spending 20-25 hours a week on a sermon? But what is he doing? Voice disorder. Those things cannot be torn apart and pitted against each other; they are part and parcel of the whole. It is the body of Christ -Rachelle. Perhaps David Platt can get some pointers from Kevin DeYoung. Id love a sabbatical too. Moses and Joshua ministered unto the LORD; Samuel was ministering unto the LORD (trimming the lamps); Paul and Barnabas were ministering unto the LORD when the Spirit separated them unto Himself (Acts 13:2). Most pastor positions are salaried. most megachurch sermons are shallow and quite devoid of teaching of Scripture. i have a feeling it is an easy process. And somebody please give me chapter and verse where it says that all these task skills need to be present in one person. Bridget, Muff, yes, yeppers, yessiree everything has to be done according to the Bible. The legal profession just balks. Madness. But they are the foundation to faith and give definition and motivation to service (in light of His great love). @ ZechZav: He will be the preaching pastor at McLean. Have you considered that its because most megachurch pastors care very little about Scripture, as thats just not the point? 14 When the people saw him[b] do this miraculous sign, they exclaimed, Surely, he is the Prophet we have been expecting![c] 15 When Jesus saw that they were ready to force him to be their king, he slipped away into the hills by himself. Jn 6:15. I cannot question it if its really Gods call for him. But theres a lot of bigger issues that a lot of people here have mentioned. We made funerals and weddings church events when they never were in Bible times. My concordance doesnt include an entry for paid pastor. We minister unto the LORD. The pastor did show for the funeral, but came with an understudy (seminary student?). When people grasp us too strongly, either with their love or with their dependence, we are intuitively conscious that they are not looking to God, and we become paralyzed in our efforts to help them. After all, they could have easily marketed themselves, promoted themselves, and charged money at the gate to hear their Holy Spirit inspired messageswhy didnt they take advantage of people? My Comment was Deleted Its probably part of his Radical mantra live and give until you are no longer sane and totally burn out. Unless you show me some passages that demonstrate it was the norm. IMO Platt is an unethical showman, plain and simple. Anything bursting in there makes surgery, clean up, and recovery much more extensive. http://www.bpnews.net/49530/harveybattered-churches-sue-for-fema-funds. And it did help him escape that radical existence he taught. I would like to say to all of you. @ ZechZav: I have not seen any statistics about what percentage of whom want what, but I too have seen behind the curtain, but it is the curtain not of some organization but rather the curtain behind which lurk the professionally religious, and I want none of the like messing with my life/ family/ ideas or whatever. Thanks, very insightful from your experience with boots on the ground. Definitions are all changing under our feet (the boundary markers are being moved). It is not a place for mature Christians to sit in the back and ask 1 man what can you do for me?. He is doing exactly this! Because those are more entertaining, particularly to a TV audience. Personally, this is sad because we have a long-ago connection to McLean Bible. I use Word, revelation, and proclamation almost inter-changeably. 4:10). He needs a vacation, so do I from LIFE. Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them. Acts 2:41, NKJV I do not make any claim to have arrived as a Christian, but I do have a daily practical intentional walk with Jesus. Third thought is what is wrong with Trustees in the SBC that they cannot act? Sermon on the Mount definitely I look forward to further comments if you are so inclined, Seulement vous, Jsus peut montrer cette vision de lhomme aveugle! (1)), Spy I dont remember exactly who was there, but I remembered wondering how they could fill their other responsibilities and who was footing the bill. We all need to be fed. If I baked you 10 cookies but one had poison would you eat one or just throw the entire batch out? McLeanBible Church, originally nondenominational, isa recent member of the Southern Baptist Convention. We were an all volunteer army. I think there is more going on. Its a long and somewhat boring story. 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